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Episode 35
Submitted by Eric on Tue, 07/22/2008 - 01:52.
in
This episode we get our hadcore nerd on over The Dark Knight, the crew convinces me to try giving comic books a shot, and we listen to some great double feature suggestions via voicemail.
Spoilers run from 17:00 to 1:40:00.
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Dudes
We talked about this movie for nearly 2 hours and we failed to mention Eric Fucking Roberts. We're slipping!
ROBERTS!
I mentioned that he was in there, but think I was making an even nerdier point and didn't want to get off track...
Dark Knight Rocked
Best I've seen in a long time. Watched it Sun. w/ fam at noon (nodded off a couple of times, seeing it again soon though), before that several hours of great waves at a local break, before that up all night, and a few lengthy calls to BGH. Downloading now and will be listening out at work. I forget what was said...little nervous here.
I personally would rather
I personally would rather they leave Joker alone. I can't really see anyone doing the role justice after this. BUT on our show we talked about what they could do for another. And since they have villians in twos we sort of decided that the Riddler and Catwoman would be good choices.
1) The Riddler - I personally think that if they did The Riddler as more of a Zodiac Killer type of character where he sends the police codes to decipher and such it would be a great way to do it and show Batman's more detective side that the new movies haven't really touched on yet.
2) Catwoman - If they boiled her down back to her roots with just a simple cat burglar who maybe steals something from the mob (since the other two have had the mob in them) that makes her a target and Batman can try to save her. And plus it would give another love interest so we can advance him a little past moping about other stuff. Anyone else?
www.drunkenzombie.com
And Shennanigans to Schnars
And Shennanigans to Schnars for recommending THE BLACK CAT. I got soooooooo bored during that episode. Was not a fan at all.
www.drunkenzombie.com
Anti-Shennanigans to Mark
for coming up with Doogie Schnaars-er
I don't know too much about
I don't know too much about Batman Villains but I think the Riddler would be a logical way to go. The "Zodiac" angle seems like a great way to keep the unsettling vibe of this film, though as we've all said a million times, it's going to be hard to top Ledger on this one.
Also, I think people have a hard time picturing The Riddler it w/o seeing this...
lol
same brain.
Which leads us to
Just had a thought
Does actually anyone call Ledger "The Joker" in the entire film? I'm not entirely sure. He uses the cards, and people call him freak over and over, but I'm not sure they ever used that as an actual name.
Yes they do
Yes, he's referred to as the Joker repeatedly. Two-face is never actually referred to by his name though.
"I like it when they lie still like that."
Two-Face
He is called, by proxy I guess, Two-Face in the film. Gordon says it was Dent's nickname when he was in IA.
True
I guess meant none of the characters refer to Two-face directly by name, whereas they do with the Joker.
"I like it when they lie still like that."
Yeah they called him The
Yeah they called him The Joker multiple times. The mob guys call him that, Batman says something to someone else about The Joker. It was used.
www.drunkenzombie.com
That's an interesting point.
That's an interesting point. I'm almost sure they did, but they also called him a murderer, terrorist, madman, freak etc. If they really never mentioned the name, that opens up a whole can of worms to be explored.
Drunken Zombie
Just listening to your guys' new episode now. Dave's suggestion of Phillip Seymour Hoffman as The Penguin is pretty frigging genius. I didn't realize he was an arms dealer in the comics. I just always thought he was Danny Devito in stretchy pants.
Also of note, one of my Comm teachers in college looked EXACTLY like Devito as the Penguin... and was a female. Have fun picturing that for a while.
Well back when the script
Well back when the script was still being written and people were still speculating on villians the rumor was that they were thinking of Hoffman as The Penguin. So while that is genius it was some word that was going around for a little while. But that would be great. 1) great actor 2) believable as the villian. Great casting. Another rumor was Adrian Brody as the Joker for awhile too. Crispin Glover and Brody were rumored for awhile. Both would have been great but I think neither would have taken The Joker to the level Ledger did.
So besides the Joker who does everyone else think should play some other villians? Anthony Michael Hall was cast and rumors were swirling that he would play Edward Nigma (aka The Riddler) before becoming the villian. I think he would have been a good choice for it depending on which way they wanted to take the character. So anyone else have suggestions?
www.drunkenzombie.com
Anthony Michael Hall
A.M.H. was already in The Dark Knight?
Hard to say on the riddler. I'll aim wide and say Christopher Eccleston, Doctor Who #8
AMH
He was the TV anchor that the Joker kidnaps.
"I like it when they lie still like that."
Anthony Michael Hall was the
Anthony Michael Hall was the TV news reporter guy that got kidnapped after the hospital thing and then they showed him hanging upside down reading from cards. He's been good on The Dead Zone. The last couple of seasons were crap but I blame that on writing and directing. Because he was good in the first couple of seasons.
And kudos to Chris Eccleston. That would be a good one. He's great as The Doctor and does a good job on Heroes. That would be good too. He seems like someone that would have the little bit of humor that The Riddler would need but is able to pull off the darkness that the character would require.
www.drunkenzombie.com
My bad
I meant that as 'Anthony Michael Hall already has a role in the franchise, how could they recast him as the riddler?'
AMH's a good actor but he's too bulked up nowdays for the riddler.
Ah. I meant that it was
Ah. I meant that it was rumored that that's who he would have been playing and I would have been okay with it. Now that he's in already in as someone else then yeah definitely go a different direction.
www.drunkenzombie.com
obscure
Other than the penguin, catwoman and the Riddler, none of Batman's oppenents are really reality based in the way Nolan has setup. I think that some of the more obscure villians might be an interesting approach. Lady Shiva, a ninja ganglord, or Bane, steriod enhanced serial killer, might be interesting choices, especially since both where involved at one time or another with breaking down and then build up Batman.
"I like it when they lie still like that."
Flaming Nerd Talk
and I'm liking it...go fuckin' figure. Serious though, I'll be listening to a replay later in the work week. Really dug on Eric's take on the "trinity". I'll expand by stating, yes, Batman and Joker know their morality, but how fitting is that the indecisive Harvey turns into an actual Two Face?
Also, Ledger's performance is so good for this generation today, I think this puts him up there in the same status as James Dean.
Have We Seen The Riddler Already?
So Super Famous Screenwriter Sean Keller pointed out one of the very obvious things I may missed. Maybe we did see The Riddler in Batman. How you ask? I'll let Sean explain:
Mister Reese = Mysteries = THE RIDDLER!
He’s a red head
He works at Wayne
He already knows who Batman is
He’s resourceful and intelligent
His brush with death (at the Joker’s command) is because of Batman
www.drunkenzombie.com
Mister Reese
Not a bad theory, but that dude was a bit of a schmuck to feature as the Riddler in a sequel. Then again, might be the best thing they could do, bring in a no name actor.
What on earth could they do
What on earth could they do with this guy to even make him appear intimidating?
intimidating
A really big gun?
"I like it when they lie still like that."
Dawson
Just watching Rosario Dawson on TV... she might make a good Catwoman, although obviously she doesn't really fit the ethnic type. Still though, she's got a HUGE RACK, and you know, is also a decent actress ;)
I agree, I have no desire to see that guy as a villain for an entire movie. The villains have to be played by names. If the Joker wasn't played by a name actor, this movie wouldn't have had nearly as much buzz.
Dawson 2
Don't forget, she also looks damn fine in PVC Leather. I'm all for a Rosario Dawson Catwoman! Rawr!